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Fledgling
 
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| This summer I became stepmommy to a Double Yellow Headed Amazon, who is believed to be about 13 years old. I have so many questions and I am hopeful someone here might have some answers. This is my first bird experience. This is the bird's history as I have been told. About 3 years ago, my bf adopted this male DYH, Cisco, from a woman who couldn't control him. My bf realized part of his aggressive behaviors towards the woman were because his toenail was stuck in a rubber ball of sorts! The woman thought the bird just liked to sit on the ball a lot, but he had been stuck there for several weeks. My bf had to cut the ball to free the toenail. Today that toe has only a very short nail and the toe itself seems slightly longer than the others. The bird favors his other foot but seems to perch, climb, and pick things up just fine. Since adopting him, Cisco does not bite or act aggressively to my bf at all, but he can and will bite other people. My bf has met all of his basic physical needs but that's about it, the bird rarely likes to be affectionate with him. Now I'm in the picture. I was unemployed for a few months, so I started trying to make friends with Cisco. We have done very well together I think. He will go up and down from my hand, and he will let me pet him most of the time. So here are my questions: 1. Over the past month, Cisco has only bit when we had guests over. The last two times, which occurred over the past 3 weeks, I was talking to a female guest (different woman each time) when he climbed off of his cage and walked up to the guest. The first time, I picked him up, the guest went to pet him, and he climbed onto her arm and bit her hard. The second time, he climbed off of his cage, walked to the guest, I told him "up" and gave him my arm, which he promptly bit very hard. I am not sure if he is jealous, or if he is trying to show dominence, or what. I hate to lock him in his cage when people come over, I want him to learn to behave appropriately. My response both times he did this was to lightly tap the top of his head, say NO very sternly several times, and lock him in his cage until they left. Once they are gone and he is let out, he is sweet as pie again. 2. I have read that pellets are better food for birds than seed mixes. Currently he is given Hartz Parrot Diet, which looks like a lot of seed to me. I also give him fresh people food daily, like veggies, fruits, pastas, beans. He will eat anything. He doesn't look overweight to me but I wouldn't necessarily be able to tell. What kind of pellet food is best for him? What brand do you all use for your Amazons? 3. He is banded; the band says NMA 1134 (I think that's the number, I might be a digit off). I have not been able to figure out what breeder that might be from, and I'd love to track down where he is from and find out his exact date of birth or at least confirm his approximate age. Any tips on how to go about this? 4. We're not sure if he needs a larger cage or not. His current cage is 18" wide, 18" deep, and 32" tall. I know that is small for his breed but he spends a good deal of time sitting on top of it as well as sitting in it, and we also have a homemade play perch for him. The play perch is a 30" tall piece of a branch with 4 smaller branches that stick out appx. 12" - 15", and the main branch is nailed onto a milk crate, which is on a large piece of cardboard. There is a sturdy metal ladder from the birdcage that is screwed on so he can easily climb on and off the milk crate. We have toys dangling from the smaller branches. He generally is put on (or goes to) the play perch every day, anywhere from 30 minutes to several hours. My bf made the play perch when we dissembled the play area from the top of his cage; we had hoped he would be less aggressive if he wasn't so far over my head, and indeed that stopped a lot of his biting at me when we first started to make friends. 5. I didn't believe Cisco could talk...until one day I was in the bedroom, out of sight, and I heard him saying Hello, Prettybird, What, Hahahaha, over and over again! As soon as I came into the room I gave him a half of a cracker as a treat, and I give him a treat whenever I hear him talk or even make an unusual sound (he makes this odd WooWoo sound sometimes, I have no idea why). I talk to him all the time; I say Good Morning several times when I greet him 1st thing, I say Good Night at bedtime, I say Hello whenever I great him, I say Prettybird all the time as well as BabyBoy and BabyBird, and I say Thank You when I give him food or a treat. Plus I just talk to him. What else can I do to encourage him to talk, or should I just accept that he's not much of a talker? He also never shrieks like so many birds do, so perhaps he is just a quiet bird. Sorry for the lengthy post and so many questions! I adore this bird and want to learn more about him. I've read several books on Amazons and I've been reading Bird Talk magazine but there is so much I do not know. Thanks for reading.
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Feather Fanatic
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| The amazon owners will probably be able to answer better than I, but thought I'd reply! 1. I hate to lock him in his cage when people come over, I want him to learn to behave appropriately. My response both times he did this was to lightly tap the top of his head, say NO very sternly several times, and lock him in his cage until they left. Once they are gone and he is let out, he is sweet as pie again.
It is *NOT* recommended to physically punish a bird. A stern "No" the evil eye, and a time-out in a cage (preferrably no food, water, toys - otherwise you teach the bird to bite in order to go back to it's cage where it can have fun!) for 15 minutes, or in a seperate room would be enough. Regardless, his reaction to strangers may be to protect you... even yes, when he bites you. They are unknown, strange, scary. What else is he supposed to do? Your best bet is to allow strangers to interact with him from 'afar' i.e. no physical contact. However, talking, reading, singing etc to the bird are just fine. They can even try feeding him treats, but otherwise to not directly interact with him. Given time, the zon may warm up to them. 2. I have read that pellets are better food for birds than seed mixes. Currently he is given Hartz Parrot Diet, which looks like a lot of seed to me. I also give him fresh people food daily, like veggies, fruits, pastas, beans. He will eat anything. He doesn't look overweight to me but I wouldn't necessarily be able to tell. What kind of pellet food is best for him? What brand do you all use for your Amazons?
I'm not a fan of Hartz, or for that matter, any food mixes found in grocery stores, and most found in petstores. I do not care for dyes, or foods high in peanuts (aflotoxins - fungi) or sunflower seeds (small amount is okay). There are a lot of mixes, such as Goldenfeast, Kaylor of Colorado, and some others I can't recall at the moment... (I don't own any large birds so I don't know what a good seed blend would be for them) As for pellets, I'd recommend a natural/organic mix if at all possible. Pellets aren't necessarily better than seeds, as some species, or individuals within those species, cannot survive on a diet that consists of pellets, even if it's only 25% of the diet. With that in mind, I'd recommend TOP's, Foundation Formula original, Roudybush, or Harrison's. There's also Zupreem, Lafebers, or..... As for fresh foods, it would be good to stick with a diet that consists about 15% cooked/sprouted legumes, 30% cooked/sprouted grains, 45% fresh/frozen/steamed veggies, and 10% fresh/frozen fruits (the fresher the better) with the occasional cooked eggs, sprouted seeds (which can be fed daily), and other supplements. Amazons need a diet lower in fat but higher in vitamin A... therefore Red Palm Oil (bought at health food stores in the cooking section, or off the internet) would be a great supplement to add to the diet! Check out this thread! http://board.birdchannel.com/Topic195864-6-1.aspx 3. He is banded; the band says NMA 1134 (I think that's the number, I might be a digit off). I have not been able to figure out what breeder that might be from, and I'd love to track down where he is from and find out his exact date of birth or at least confirm his approximate age. Any tips on how to go about this?
Is the band an open band or a closed band? If it's an open band, this zon might be a wild caught bird, and about 17 years old... below is a list of links that may be able to help out... If your breeder is listed, you could find him here...
National Center of Bird Leg Bands Directory
A YH group that helps trace bands
LegBandNumbers : Leg Band Numbers
A couple places that produce leg bands may or may not help trace the band if it's one of theirs...
L_M_Bird Leg Bands Products Catalogue
Red Bird Products
Information on Leg Bands
Winged Wisdom Pet Bird Magazine - The ABC's Of Leg Bands - Identifying Birds
Choosing Your Bird 4. We're not sure if he needs a larger cage or not. His current cage is 18" wide, 18" deep, and 32" tall. I know that is small for his breed but he spends a good deal of time sitting on top of it as well as sitting in it, and we also have a homemade play perch for him. We have toys dangling from the smaller branches.
I would not recommend a cage smaller than 32" x 23" x 65" (approximately) for an amazon... [cage size you have I'd recommend, at best, for one budgie, or one cockatiel - although that may be just me] What if neither one of you are home? Or you go on vacation? Or there's an emergency? If no one can handle him, he'll need to stay in his cage. And when you add in a variety of perches, toys, and dishes, that doesn't leave much room for the bird. Birds need at least 3-5 toys, and being that amazons are such 'couch potatoes' they need plenty of toys to keep them occupied and busy so that they don't become fat and lazy. He should also have natural and rope perches, among a variety of other types. If he's not clipped, I'd also encourage him to fly by gently tossing him onto a bed, or running about the house, or at the least, holding him on your hand and dropping your hand (slowly at first, so as to not frighten him, but pick up the speed forcing him to flap his wings). Try and make the experience fun and enjoyable! If he isn't having fun, you'll end up with a moody birdy... You may find the below links helpful (hopefully) to ensure your zon doesn't become a couch potato, or if he/she already is, then to hopefully get him more active! Articles on foraging...
HolisticBird and HolisticBirds
Foraging for Parrots
Parrot Enrichment
Foraging Ahead
Easy Foraging Ideas
Kibibi's InfoSuperFlyway - Top Ten Favorite Parrot Foraging Toys
Below are some ideas for toys and toy making supplies!
PEAB / PEAB
PEAB2 / PEAB2
Cheep Parrot Toys N Tips
Bird Toy Outlet
Birdy Boredom Busters
Birds Just Wanna Have Fun
Twin Leather Company
For the Love of Birds - For Birds Sake Toys
Nalani Toys
Parrotdise Perch
Talon Treasures
California Bird Nerds--Simple Joys and Safer Bird Toys 5. I didn't believe Cisco could talk...until one day I was in the bedroom, out of sight, and I heard him saying Hello, Prettybird, What, Hahahaha, over and over again! As soon as I came into the room I gave him a half of a cracker as a treat, and I give him a treat whenever I hear him talk or even make an unusual sound (he makes this odd WooWoo sound sometimes, I have no idea why).
He sounds like a closet talker... not much you may be able to do other than to keep trying to encourage him! I've got a mitred conure who'll talk at home, but he wont utter a word if out and about. He's not a big talker, either just knows a few words.
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Feather Fanatic
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HI and welcome to the forum and life with an Amazon!
I have a BFA and have had her since she was 5 months old. She is 8 yrs now.
Here are some general things. BFA, DYA and Panama ( or is it yellow nape) are called the 'hot three'. This means that they are the most excitable of an easily excited bird.
First, you did not say if the bird was taken to an avian vet for a complete well bird check. I would bet that the bird had not been to a vet before, so it is more important than ever to have it go in now. The vet can tell you about weight and what is really going on with his legs and if there are any health issues connected with the heavy seed diet.
I would say the ball situation was abuse. To let the animal sit like that for several weeks was totally not acceptable and your boyfriend should be praised for his quick response to the situation. The toe may be deformed now. Check the color, and temp and shape to see if it compares to the same toe on the other foot. His leg could have been twisted or even broken. This is not a small thing. They spend 24/7 on their feet. The vet can prescribe medications for pain and swelling if this is the case and can even do surgery.
You are providing a good diet for the bird and it is surprising that with his past that he eats such a variety of foods. I would, though, get him off the seed diet and move him onto a good pellet. If you can get him to eat the uncolored ones that is best. To make sure that your bird gets a good selection, you can mix several different pellet brands and shapes in his food bowl. That way, anything that is missing from one will most likely show up in the others. I try to stay away from high corn and peanut content pellets. But that is not something you HAVE to follow.
Go on line ( poopology) to see what his droppings should look like and monitor them to make sure everything is going in and coming out correctly. The droppings of a bird is the first thing that most people can tell if the bird has a problem. It is what should be monitored every day. I put a sheet of wax paper under the favored perch at night so the biggest, first, morning poop will get caught there and not get discolored or other wise changed by the type of paper under him. Other wise, plain old black and white news paper is excellent cage liner.
The cage is way too small, as you said. The bare minimum size should be two times the bird's width with wings out stretched in at least one direction and two times the length of the bird. So the smallest cage should be about 32 tall x 32 x24. As far as most people are concerned, that is still way too small. You have to be able to fit perches and toys in there and they take up a lot of room. My cage is 60 x 30x 36. and if I could, I would like to put her in a cage that is wider in both directions.
Tapping the bird on the head with your finger is like swatting the dog or you on the head with a news paper. It seems like a good idea, but if you put yourself in the same situation, you would not like it at all. Also, parrots do not respond well to punishment. They are more apt to learn that violence begets violence. Simply giving a stern 'NO" with a dirty look and putting the bird back in the cage for a time out is the best way to respond to unwanted behavior. If you have the bird trained to step up on a hand held perch, this is the time to take advantage of it. You are less likely to get another bite using the perch instead of your arm.
This is one of my own little tricks or what ever. But I do not put birds on my arm. The arm is a rapid rout to the shoulder and the face. You don't have much control of your arm. Try to teach the bird to step up on your hand. Let him grip your fingers between the thumb and pointer finger while you hold your hand as if you are going to shake hands. This way, you can easily move the bird up and down and close and far to help control unwanted behavior. Also you can give the 'earth quake". This is a tiny shake or wiggle of your hand to make the bird slightly off balance so they must pay attention to staying there. Too much of a wiggle and the bird will either fly off, fall off or bite. So just a tiny movement.
Amazons are biters of a group of birds that bite anyway. It is a part of who they are. The biting at you when there is company can be related to jealousy, fear and excitability because of the hub bub of human interaction. I would try to move the bird to a protected area of the house. Try it with the bird in an area where he can see the activity and if he is still excited, move him farther away till he is in a place that he can accept. Eventually, he may be able to slowly move closer to the goings on as he gets more secure.
The fact that he choses to talk means that he can learn more words. Eventually he will repeat your hello and good by and thank you and words relating to games like Peek a boo. If you associate the word with an object or activity you are most likely to get him to learn the word. Parrots learn just as we do. You teach a child 'apple' when you give him an apple much sooner than you teach him a word that does not make a connection. also, words that get a big reaction are learned fast. Many people complain that their birds say ( clearly and often) curse words. The reason why is that when a human says them they are often excited and they often make others excited. Parrots LOVE drama. You can use this to your advantage. My birds learned 'hello' because that word is said with a lot of feeling or noise. But they have also learned some words I would prefer they didn't for the same reason. when they are learning a word, they are apt to mumble the sounds till they feel they have them right. But right is how they hear the word. So, for example, my BFA says "olive ooo" for "I love you".
This is a lot of info for now. I think you are really doing well and are surely on the right track with this bird. Just remember it takes time to develop trust and love.
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Feather Fanatic
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| You have gotten great replies already so Ill just add a little 1. Over the past month, Cisco has only bit when we had guests over. The last two times, which occurred over the past 3 weeks, I was talking to a female guest (different woman each time) when he climbed off of his cage and walked up to the guest. The first time, I picked him up, the guest went to pet him, and he climbed onto her arm and bit her hard. The second time, he climbed off of his cage, walked to the guest, I told him "up" and gave him my arm, which he promptly bit very hard. I am not sure if he is jealous, or if he is trying to show dominence, or what. I hate to lock him in his cage when people come over, I want him to learn to behave appropriately. My response both times he did this was to lightly tap the top of his head, say NO very sternly several times, and lock him in his cage until they left. Once they are gone and he is let out, he is sweet as pie again. I would not have him out around guests at all...My DYH is not guest friendly so as soon as we get company he has to go back to the bird room. DYH amazons are moody, and as mine gets older he gets moodier. 2. I have read that pellets are better food for birds than seed mixes. Currently he is given Hartz Parrot Diet, which looks like a lot of seed to me. I also give him fresh people food daily, like veggies, fruits, pastas, beans. He will eat anything. He doesn't look overweight to me but I wouldn't necessarily be able to tell. What kind of pellet food is best for him? What brand do you all use for your Amazons? Let him pick what pellets he likes, that way if he will eat one they problem is solved. There are several companies that offer samples, thats a good way to let him pick. But I would switch to a different brand of seed too. Pocco gets a mix with NO sunflowers in it. 3. He is banded; the band says NMA 1134 (I think that's the number, I might be a digit off). I have not been able to figure out what breeder that might be from, and I'd love to track down where he is from and find out his exact date of birth or at least confirm his approximate age. Any tips on how to go about this? 4. We're not sure if he needs a larger cage or not. His current cage is 18" wide, 18" deep, and 32" tall. I know that is small for his breed but he spends a good deal of time sitting on top of it as well as sitting in it, and we also have a homemade play perch for him. The play perch is a 30" tall piece of a branch with 4 smaller branches that stick out appx. 12" - 15", and the main branch is nailed onto a milk crate, which is on a large piece of cardboard. There is a sturdy metal ladder from the birdcage that is screwed on so he can easily climb on and off the milk crate. We have toys dangling from the smaller branches. He generally is put on (or goes to) the play perch every day, anywhere from 30 minutes to several hours. My bf made the play perch when we dissembled the play area from the top of his cage; we had hoped he would be less aggressive if he wasn't so far over my head, and indeed that stopped a lot of his biting at me when we first started to make friends. The bigger the cage the better, do you have a picture of his set up? 5. I didn't believe Cisco could talk...until one day I was in the bedroom, out of sight, and I heard him saying Hello, Prettybird, What, Hahahaha, over and over again! As soon as I came into the room I gave him a half of a cracker as a treat, and I give him a treat whenever I hear him talk or even make an unusual sound (he makes this odd WooWoo sound sometimes, I have no idea why). I talk to him all the time; I say Good Morning several times when I greet him 1st thing, I say Good Night at bedtime, I say Hello whenever I great him, I say Prettybird all the time as well as BabyBoy and BabyBird, and I say Thank You when I give him food or a treat. Plus I just talk to him. What else can I do to encourage him to talk, or should I just accept that he's not much of a talker? He also never shrieks like so many birds do, so perhaps he is just a quiet bird. My DYH talks the most for Shane, he likes him better and is more comfortable with him. Just keep working with him and making him more comfortable with you and he may talk more. My Red-lored amazon does not talk unless it is loud in the room..so then you can't hear him.
Visit my blog and see what my flocks been up to at www.bfids.crazybirdlady.com(Adding and changing things often!)
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Fledgling
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| Thanks for the warm welcome and the feedback! There is so much good information here. I think once the holidays are over, we will get him a larger cage and also take him for a check up. He is such a good bird, I want to make sure he is healthy and happy. I was home today because of the weather and we had so much fun, he is so lovey-dovey when it is just the two of us. I guess I will just look online and see what kind of pellets are out there - I too would also like an organic one, I don't like the fact that when he puts his current food in the water, the water turns blue or green from the coloring added! He will eat anything so I'd be surprised if he gets upset at a switch in his diet.
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Feather Fanatic
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You may want to think about getting him a water bottle. Lixit makes a glass bottle with a heavy duty spout that even my macaw can not mangle. My birds would make poop soup if they did not drink from bottles. If you get one, get two. That way one can be getting washed while the other is being used. One concern , though, is if your bird likes to stick things in the spout and clog it up. But of all the birds I have worked with that have used the bottle or similar watering system.....about 70, 3 liked to clog the spout, and one would not drink from a bottle.
To make sure it is working, fill it full and stick a toothpick in the lickky hole so it makes water drip and the stick shows about 1/2 inch or more from the tube. Eventually, you will see that the stick is pulled out and you will know that the bird is drinking from the bottle. it usually takes a couple of hours.
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Feather Fanatic
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Fledgling
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| This is my bird, he is so cute. :) 
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Fledgling
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| Another question (sorry): How often should he bathe? I only see him bathe 1-2x a month. He seems clean but it seems like he ought to bathe more. I keep a spray bottle that sprays a fine mist; I keep the water room temperature and I have thoroughly misted him twice with it. Both times he seemed to be fine with it, he was very calm and acted like it was no big deal. The first time, when I stopped he then went to his cage and threw water all over himself from his water bowl. The second time he didn't do anything really (except drip water lol). I was thinking of maybe misting him really well once per week. I made sure the house was a little extra warm, too.
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Once a week would be good, Pocco hates if he gets it more than that. But i do try to do it 2 times weekly.
Visit my blog and see what my flocks been up to at www.bfids.crazybirdlady.com(Adding and changing things often!)
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